Bundestag member and Christian Democratic Union (CDU) defence and foreign policy expert Roderich Kiesewetter said in an interview with DW that everything must be done to ensure Ukraine can strike targets in Russia. But he warned against Germany being directly involved in the war. The German politician from the largest opposition faction in the German parliament said this on Thursday, 8 February, in Kyiv, where he was. On the same day, German Chancellor Olaf Scholz arrived in the United States on a visit.
DW: You are in Ukraine now. What did you see? How do you feel about Ukraine these days?
Roderich Kiesewetter: I have met or re-met very interested spokesmen in the Ministry of Defence, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Parliament, and humanitarian organisations helping people at the front and veterans. Overall, I see that the population continues to fight, including yesterday when several people died and many were wounded in Kyiv and is aware of what is at stake if Ukraine’s freedom is lost.
— In this context, financial support is important for Ukraine. But the day before, a bill on a new package of American aid to Ukraine failed in the US Senate. German Chancellor Olaf Scholz, in turn, is having trouble pushing other EU countries to do more for Ukraine. Germany is the largest supplier of weapons to Ukraine in the EU. Will Germany be able to replace the US as the main supplier of military and financial aid to Ukraine?
— It is not a question of possibilities, it is a question of political will. In 2022, Germany spent 200 billion euros on its national interests to reduce the effects of inflation and rising energy prices. We can free up large sums of money in a short time. This would also be possible for Ukraine. However, what is much more important is that the actions of Trump, who has not even been elected (president — Ed. ), should be a wake-up call for all of Europe. We cannot make ourselves dependent on the imaginary dictator that Trump likes to portray, on Putin’s tool, which Trump is. It is good that Chancellor Scholz will point this out to the Americans. It is important that the German Chancellor, Macron, the British Prime Minister Sunak, Tusk from Poland, Meloni from Italy and others, signal to the Americans and say that we share the burden and take on more responsibility for Ukraine. But we expect the Americans to continue to see themselves as a pro-European power.
And one more thought. If Ukraine fails, it will be terrible. Millions of Ukrainians will leave their country and threaten the cohesion of European states. It will also show that the West is incapable of stopping a dictator like Putin, who in a terrible bloodbath mindlessly sacrifices hundreds of thousands of his soldiers, and that we are incapable of confronting Putin, the evil of it all – Putin and his criminal war of aggression.
That is why we need to show Russia that this cannot go on any longer. Russia must recognize the right of its neighbours to exist. The war must be transferred to Russia. Russian military installations and headquarters must be destroyed. We must do everything possible so that Ukraine can destroy not only oil refineries in Russia, but also ministries, command posts, and firing points.
It is time for the Russian people to realize that they have a dictator who is sacrificing the future of Russia, sacrificing the future of Russia’s youth and ethnic minorities, that this is a country that is essentially bringing war to the world instead of becoming a force for peace.
— Let’s imagine the worst-case scenario for Ukraine, if the US stops providing it with aid, what consequences could this have for the country?
— Firstly, the European defence industry is robust. 60 percent of what it produces is exported outside Europe. And now we need to reconsider priorities and first of all the supply to Ukraine.
Secondly, Germany should no longer hold pan-European tenders for the defence industry, but rather do as the Rheinmetall and Krauss-Maffei Wegmann deal (with Ukraine – Ed. ) suggests, directly through national procurement. In addition, Germany should provide financial guarantees and sureties.
Much would be possible if there were political will. For now, it does not depend on the Foreign Ministry or the Defence Ministry, but on the will of the Finance Minister and the Federal Chancellery.
It is hard to imagine if all this fails, because then the German world order and the European Union will be gone, and we will become a participant in a war. That is exactly what Russia wants. It wants to drag us into a war, and we are preventing this by redirecting our defence production and supplying it to Ukraine, to do everything possible so that Ukraine can continue to defend our peace and defend our freedom.
For this, Ukraine deserves membership in the EU and then NATO. This is also part of the support for Ukraine preparing to join the European Union and the North Atlantic Alliance, as is the transfer of the defence industry to Ukraine so that production can take place directly on the spot.
— How can we ensure the security of this industry in Ukraine, given the terrible missile attacks?
— First, Russia is deliberately attacking residential buildings, schools, hospitals, nursing homes, churches and cultural institutions to destroy the existence of the Ukrainian people, and its great history. Second, Russia is destroying electricity and water systems to threaten the survival of the population. We must repeat this again and again: Russia wants to destroy Ukraine’s right to exist, and therefore Ukraine deserves any support, especially when it is under fire. This means that we must supply more air defense systems because Ukraine has already learned to intelligently protect its industry with appropriate air defense systems.
The solution is not to talk about what will happen if things go badly but to do more to show Russia its borders, to make the Russian people see what terrible crimes are being committed in their name.
— What signal does the delay in American aid to Ukraine send to Moscow, and how will Putin perceive this?
– This is, of course, to Putin’s advantage. During his election campaign, he can say that he has a friend in Trump and use this to destroy the cohesion of the West. That is why Scholz in the US must make it clear what is at stake, and that the members of the Bundestag, who have very good connections with Republican and Democratic members of parliament, also make it clear that they are being held hostage by Trump, essentially held hostage by a criminal – after all, Trump has been declared a criminal in American courts – and that the Americans must do everything possible to ensure that they are not being controlled by a criminal.
Putin is a known criminal, he is officially declared a war criminal in more than 100 countries, but we must not allow a leading Western power to elect a criminal as its leader. This must be said openly because it will cause great damage to the reputation and credibility of the United States. And so we must exert more influence on the American population, showing what is at stake. But it is much more important that European countries now join forces and first solve the most important issues. The most important thing is to increase defence production for Ukraine and give it a place in the European Union and, as soon as security conditions allow, in NATO.
— What do you expect from the German Chancellor’s visit to the United States?
– I expect him to stir up the Senate and the House of Representatives and that he, since he never makes decisions himself, will finally get the green light to deliver TAURUS cruise missiles. I expect Scholz to come back and say that the Americans have agreed to deliver TAURUS since I myself have never made up my mind about it.
DW
