Vadim Shtepa – Hello, Oleg. My first question is of a historical nature. As far as I understand, the current Anti-Imperial Bloc of Nations is the successor to the Anti-Bolshevik Bloc of Nations, which was created back in the era of the UPA? Did it have any educational projects for the enslaved peoples of the Moscow Empire?
Oleg Vitvitsky – You are right, the Anti-Imperial Block of Nations is a direct continuation of the work of the Anti-Bolshevik Bloc of Nations, which was created 80 years ago during the Second World War on the territory of Ukraine, more precisely in Western Ukraine, in Volyn. I believe that this is very symbolic that just on the anniversary, we were able not only to revive the ABN in the format of the Anti-Imperial Bloc of Nations but also to begin very important projects – specific practical cases that have already brought results.
If we talk about history, then the time when the Anti-Bolshevik Bloc of Nations was founded was also wartime, therefore, some analogies can be drawn. But in the 1940s there were no special opportunities to implement any educational projects because everyone operated underground. Ukrainians, Bashkirs, Georgians, Belarusians, and Azerbaijanis fought against the NKVD – they fought together with weapons in their hands. But the history of the Anti-Bolshevik Bloc of Nations is much broader – it also touches on the times of the so-called Cold War, when our predecessors implemented various political, and social information, including educational projects.
Now, of course, we are on a completely different level, because we continue our work under the conditions of independent Ukrainian statehood and can more actively support the nations still under the rule of the Moscow Empire. This gives much more opportunities, but also, probably, more responsibility.
— What is included in the programme of your University of Free Nations? Is it political philosophy, economics, or sociology? What other areas do you try to teach your students? And the listeners, as I understand it, are representatives of various national and regional movements who now find themselves in political exile.
– Absolutely. When we revived the Anti-Imperial Bloc of Nations, we decided to gather a round table of representatives of various movements representing the nations of the empire still enslaved. Although we do not call them enslaved, but rather free nations who are fighting for their statehood, their independence and freedom, under the same slogans that both the UPA and the Anti-Bolshevik Bloc of Nations declared back in 1943: “Freedom for nations! Freedom for the Individual.” This is an absolutely democratic approach.
The students of our University were representatives of various national movements: Chechens, Dagestanis, Ingush, Tatars, Bashkirs, Buryats, Yakuts, Karelians and others, I can’t even list them all. We work intensively with students for two to three months and this is already considered a full course – we completed gathering this first intake in early November and successfully completed the course by the New Year. So we already have our first graduates. They took a very intensive course: these were theoretical classes, but aimed at practice. Courses were taught in political science, jurisprudence, international law, the history of national liberation movements, information security and other subjects that we believe will be useful to students of the University of Free Nations.
All this was taught at a very high level, because, in addition to students, we also carefully select our teachers, speakers, and trainers. I cannot name their names, since they are now busy in very important areas during the war. But these are very professional teachers, and we are very grateful to them for responding to our initiative and giving very deep and relevant knowledge to our students. Also, upon completion of the course, students did their graduation project. The topics of the projects were close to modelling the struggle for independence in certain regions of the so-called Russian Federation. And we are glad that they managed to prepare such projects, and practical case studies for the struggle for freedom and independence.
I would also like to emphasize that the training took place in Russian, as we call it, the trophy language. This was not easy for many of the teachers, since this is not our native language, but we still understand that our target audience speaks it. By the way, excuse me for my poor-quality Russian – I rarely use it.
— Your Russian is wonderful, everything is absolutely clear. In general, one cannot assume that the Russian language belongs to Russia, just as English does not belong to Great Britain or Spanish to Spain. They are spoken in different countries and are simply a means of communication.
But my next question will be on a related topic and may sound controversial. It is about the difference between the eras in which your historical predecessors from the Anti-Bolshevik Bloc of Nations operated, and today. The difference is precisely demographic. If in the USSR non-Russian nations made up approximately half of the population, then in the current Russian Federation, they are only about 20%. Accordingly, the ethnic picture is completely different. Of course, we must support the independence of all current national republics in Russia. But if you work only with national minorities, this will not affect the bulk of the population and, accordingly, will not destroy the empire. A well-known researcher of national and regional problems in Eurasia, Paul Goble, rightly notes that this approach is reminiscent of generals who are preparing for the last war. So, the question is: do you plan to work with Russian regionalists – after all, there are many different ones: from Königsberg in the west to Khabarovsk in the Far East, there is the Ingermanland movement in St. Petersburg, supporters of the Ural Republic, various Siberian movements and so on. How do you look at collaborating with them and involving them in your University’s projects?
– First of all, I would like to doubt the accuracy of the percentage that you cited. After all, we know that throughout Soviet history the authorities forcibly registered many as “Russians”, and even now they continue to do so. For example, in the early 1990s, millions of Ukrainians lived in the Russian Federation, but now the official figures have decreased several times. So the results of the current Russian censuses can hardly be trusted.
But overall you raise the right issue. By the way, I would like to note that representatives of free Ingria, that is, the regionalist movement, also took the course at our University. Of course, we plan to work more actively not only with national movements but also with regional ones. And we will probably have to somehow differentiate our courses. We will willingly communicate and share our knowledge with everyone who believes that the future lies with free states on the ruins of the Moscow empire.
— As far as I understand, all your teachers are from Ukraine, and, for example, you don’t involve European or American professors yet?
— I will say that many of our teachers have academic experience abroad, but now they are all in Ukraine and working for the country. The first intake of our University was very successful and caused a positive reaction in both the media and academic circles. So in the following intakes, we will try to involve well-known Western teachers in our work. By the way, we plan to conduct the second recruitment in the first half of 2024, and there will be a lot of new things there, based on the experience of analysing our first recruitment and the proposals that we receive from our colleagues. In general, we look to the future with optimism and believe that our graduates are future presidents, prime ministers or members of parliament of their newly independent states.
— Well, let me wish your University success, so that the courses you teach become effective and really influence the current situation in Russia and help its final de-imperialization.
– Thank you. I believe that our common goal will definitely be achieved, because the slogan that our predecessors put forward 80 years ago: “Freedom for nations, freedom for the Individual!” not only remains universal, but is becoming increasingly relevant.
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