— When to expect the collapse of the Russian Federation?
— The disintegration of the Russian Federation began more than 100 years ago, because the Russian Federation is the same Russian empire that was saved from disintegration by the creation of the Soviet Union. The Russian Federation is a reformatted piece of that union. And in the first and second cases too, the reasons leading to the collapse of the empire were not eliminated. That is why Russia is already falling apart today. The time of the empire has passed and no one will be able to save it. No one knows what will be the pebble that will lead to the collapse. However, we are already seeing the beginning of the collapse of the state management system. This is evident from senseless decisions and completely illogical actions. Self-destruction of this monster is inevitable, it is only a matter of time. But there is another question, are we ready for it? Time today is not working in favor of Russia, but also not in favor of Ukraine. Therefore, we must accelerate the collapse of the Russian Federation, and one of the positive catalysts of this process is work with peoples enslaved by Moscow. If we do this, the Russian Federation will fall apart faster.
— Which republics will first leave the Russian Federation? Perhaps these processes will begin with the Erzyan people?
— Today, no one knows who will be the first to leave the Russian Federation. It is held back by force, threats and persecution. However, during World War II, Moscow will not have enough strength for that and the process of secession will begin. Perhaps it will be Buryatia or the Caucasus, Bashkortostan or Tatarstan… the Far East… It is difficult to predict where it will start. Perhaps from the death of Putin or some major failure of the Russian army.
Are Erzyans ready to leave the Russian Federation? – No, not ready. I think that no one is ready. Ukraine should also prepare and prepare for the collapse of the Russian Federation, but, unfortunately, I cannot say that it is doing this. There are layers of people, among representatives of all enslaved peoples, as well as in Ukrainian society, who understand that the further development of enslaved peoples is impossible as part of the Moscow kingdom. Only independent, independent states can save our nations from extinction. Only the collapse of the Russian Federation and the creation of independent states with the active participation of Ukraine is a real Victory! This is our goal today. That is why it is necessary to unite with other peoples. It is impossible to resist attempts to recreate the Russian Federation under a different name alone. Therefore, 10 nations and regionalist movements created the “League of Free Nations”, the purpose of which is the formation of a broad anti-imperial front of socio-political and civil movements, which advocates the acquisition of real sovereignty by the peoples and territories of the Russian Federation. There is the Vilniy Idel-Ural association, the purpose of which is to create a confederation of independent national countries of the Volga region. That is, there are people, there are forces that are preparing.
— Does that mean the Erzyan people also believe in their independence and want to fight for it?
— It is the same if I ask if all Ukrainians are ready to fight for their freedom, the liberation of territories and the victory of Ukraine? Among the Erzians there are people who seek independence. I believe that this is what most Erzians strive for subconsciously. We hear this when they tell us that you will not be able to create Erzyan Mastor (Erzyan Country), but if you can, then we would live… That is, they dream about it, but the majority are not ready to take active actions and one of the main reasons is the lack of faith in their strength The task of our national movement is to get rid of this disbelief, to prepare for active actions, because we will have to fight in every case.
— How do the people of Erzyan react to the so-called SVO? Are people ready to fight in Ukraine, or do they understand that this is not their war?
— In 2014, the only people of the Russian Federation who reacted to the occupation of Crimea and the war in Donbas were Erzyans. In particular, there was a statement by the Executive Committee of our Congress, an appeal to Erzians that this is not our war, and we should not go there and let our children go. It was quite a powerful act, considering that no one else had done it at the time. And already after the full-scale offensive of Moscow, on March 8, 2022, there was a statement by the Council of Elders of the Erzian people, which condemned the actions of the Russian Federation and called on the Erzians not to go to war. Just as in other regions, in Mordovia, military commissars were burned and leaflets of an anti-war nature were pasted. Erzyans are fighting as part of the Armed Forces. Erzya Oleksiy Veshchevaylov died defending Ukraine.
Yes, there are also Erzyans among the Moscow occupiers. However, it should be emphasized that there are significantly fewer residents of Mordovia than in neighboring regions. One of the reasons, in my opinion, is that the Erzyan movement actively works with the population. I think that among the enslaved peoples, 15-18% of people understand what is happening and they do not support Putin’s regime. However, they are afraid to voice their opinion.
– Are they afraid of repression?
– So. Total control is introduced. Society lives practically in the conditions of a prison, a camp. The “lookers” rule, the laws are just an empty declaration. And it was centuries in the making. Let’s remember the past – executions, disarmament, Gulag, famines. Yes, they were also in our places. The Bolsheviks who created the Holodomor of Ukrainians “trained” on Bashkortostan, Kazakhs, and other nations. In addition, the economic component affects. Imagine you live in a district center where there is no work. The salary is 10 thousand rubles, you have a family. If you spoke out against the war in Ukraine, you will not work tomorrow, as will all family members. Erzyan is fined even for insults and articles in social networks. That is why people are killed and crushed. But it will pass!
— If all the enslaved nations unite, will it speed up the collapse of the Russian Federation? But what should be done to speed up the disintegration of Russia?
– We have already united. There is “Free Idel – Ural”, there is “League of Free Nations”. We work out a common policy, ideology, and discuss strategic and tactical points. However, the process of the final disintegration of the Russian Federation cannot begin from the middle – it would be naive to think so. It can start due to external factors. Unfortunately, Ukraine does not use this factor. Although already in 2014, it was necessary to have an Institute for the Study of Enslaved Peoples, to start media projects, to help national liberation movements, to create technical centers to help liberation movements. To date, in my opinion, Ukraine has not even formed a state policy regarding these peoples. That is, not a formed opinion, but what should the world be like after the war and what is the role of the territories of the Russian Federation in the world system. It is necessary to move away from that. The state policy in the sphere of support of peoples enslaved by Moscow must be deployed. What is currently being done in Ukraine – certain briefings or statements – does not work individually. There will be no result from that – only PR. So far, in my opinion, Ukraine is not doing anything concrete to accelerate the collapse of the Russian Federation. What is done is not ineffective.
— What steps should we take first of all in order to have a result and what role should the West play here?
– Currently, many people in the West think that saving the Russian Federation from disintegration is a good thing and let it be, as it was. However, no one will be able to do that. Therefore, I wanted Ukraine, which is currently in the center of political events, to which today the eyes of the leading countries of the world, the United States, Great Britain, and the European Union are turned, to think not in terms of individual actions, statements in the mass media, but in categories that meet the challenges that stand before Ukraine! These should be global categories!
That is, Ukraine should offer the world its scenarios for supporting the peoples enslaved by Moscow.
I repeat, if we want to influence something and change something, we must have a strategic systemic approach. And without that, we’ll be poking around, pulling from one thing to another, in the end, nothing will work out, and then we’ll say – you see, we tried, nothing works out!
So that this does not happen, there should be a global conceptual approach that will be reflected in the formation of state policy, where within the framework of this state policy, answers will be given to the questions: what is the purpose of this policy, what are the specific goals, what is the task, what does Ukraine want to achieve, what means, what resources are needed for that, what tools will be involved, what state authorities will implement this policy in Ukraine?
The Ministry of Culture and Information Policy, the Ministry of Education, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, the State Service for Ethnopolitics and Freedom of Conscience, the Main Directorate of Intelligence, etc., etc. Such a state policy in the sphere of support for peoples enslaved by Moscow must be developed.
And it should be done as soon as possible. Ukraine and the West should realize that if the Russian Federation does not disintegrate now, it will disintegrate as a result of the Third World War. And there are signs that it is very close. And so far we hear about the exit to the borders in 1991, but this is not a victory, but a loss, because, first of all, it is not even the end of the war! And secondly, if the Russian Federation remains, it remains a constant threat to Ukraine. And our grandchildren will again have to be responsible for our indecision.
— How much time is needed to develop a state strategy for the collapse of the Russian Federation?
— This question is not for me, it is necessary to ask the authorities. But in Ukraine, the public has already done a lot in this direction. There are many studies and articles. Take, for example, ” Manifesto for Sustainable Peace: The World After Our Victory, ” which was developed by Ukrainian intellectuals as a vision of the postwar world. The document also outlines ways to achieve it!
There are enough literate, intelligent people in Ukraine to deal with this quickly, given that there is a war going on. And the elements of such a policy can already be events, information centers, media projects, support centers for national liberation movements… And then the leaders of these movements will stay in Ukraine and work for the benefit of Ukraine and their peoples, because our interests coincide… And for now, they are going to Lithuania, Estonia, Poland, Great Britain, Turkey…
But even today there are representatives of all enslaved peoples in Ukraine. You just have to find them. Provide technical support, give them microphones, cameras and make news about it and shape the worldview. There is a war of existence, here it is impossible to achieve victory solely by force. It is necessary to change the consciousness of enslaved peoples. This does not require large funds. By the way, the Erzyan movement in Ukraine works without any support from the state. We independently produce news and media projects. The “League of Free Nations”, the “Free Idel-Ural” society works with enslaved peoples. Aid to these organizations would be a great contribution to the cause of accelerating the collapse of the Russian Federation. But, instead of this, Ukraine is creating the “Russian Volunteer Corps”, the “Legion of Freedom of Russia”. In Ukraine, how do Ponomaryovs and Feygins walk around at home… The question arises, and who are we fighting? With the Buryats? With mokshanas? That is why I claim that the state strategy for the disintegration of the enemy country, the aggressor country, has not been formed.
— What is being done so that people living on the territory of the Russian Federation understand why it is necessary to fight for the independence of their own people?
— Our organizations have their own resources, pages, groups in various social networks. To summarize, we carry out campaigning and propaganda in the languages of the indigenous peoples of the Russian Federation. That is, it is anti-Russian and anti-war agitation, propaganda in the languages of indigenous peoples, popularization of independent ideas and centripetal attitudes. Establishing contacts with activists on the ground. In fact, we are the only source of alternative information in national languages.
We are constantly in touch with our peoples and see that people are beginning to perceive the situation differently. Our materials are viewed by thousands of people. By the way, my appeal to the residents of Mordovia regarding mobilization was viewed by 5 million viewers. Although the population of Mordovia is only 760,000. Therefore, I will emphasize once again that there are many times fewer residents of Mordovia fighting in Ukraine than from other regions.
I must add that this work of ours finds the understanding of the Ukrainian public and we are sincerely grateful to the Ukrainians! This understanding has its own history. In the autumn of 1943, the OUN held the First Conference of the Enslaved Peoples of Eastern Europe and Asia! During the war, in the occupied territory, in Volyn in the Rivne district! It was “just in time”! It was not only a help to enslaved peoples, it was a necessity! The destruction of the Moscow state and the creation of independent, free countries was, and remains, a mandatory condition for the Victory of Ukraine! Ukrainian nationalists understood this even then! Do they understand now? Society — yes! The authorities, in my opinion – no!
There is an existential, cultural war, a war of concepts and principles. It cannot be won only by military means. Therefore, it is necessary to fight for consciousness. It is possible! I know this for myself, because I was a communist, a Soviet officer, but thanks to the Ukrainian influence, today I have completely different views, a different consciousness.
Let’s go back to the beginning of our conversation. How long to wait for the collapse of the Russian Federation? If you wait, it’s a very long time. Therefore, I want to emphasize once again that we must work to accelerate the collapse of the Russian Federation!
Kateryna Krasovska
I-UA.TV
